Episode 25 - Cindy Luquin: Womb Work as Shadow Work

Cindy Luquin (she/they) has a wealth of experience in transforming adversity into beauty through a passion for reproductive healthcare for all, rooted in justice and health. She and Josie discuss grief and fertility, the ways pleasure plays a role in healing, the beauty of consent, and the utter magic of breaking cycles of generational trauma through womb work.

[ID: A beige background and orange semi-circle. Text reads: The Intersectional Fertility Podcast Episode 25: Cindy Luquin @howlatthewomb and Josie Rodriguez-Bouchier @intersectionalfertility.]

Connect with Cindy on Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, or on their website.

Book a session with them here.

Episode Transcript:

Disclaimer: This is an automatically generated transcript edited to be more readable. It may not be 100% accurate.

[00:00:00] Josie: I'm Josie Rodriguez-Bouchier, and this is the Intersectional Fertility Podcast where ideas and identities intersect to deepen our understanding of fertility and ultimately our whole selves.

[00:00:23] Cindy Luquin is a certified bilingual sexual health expert and owner of Howl at the Womb. She is a queer Salvadorian, Guatemalan, American woman who educates people and organizations through professional trainings on gender equity, comprehensive sex education, and access to reproductive and sexual healthcare for all.

[00:00:46] Their values as a leader are rooted in reproductive justice frameworks that contribute to the movement by destigmatizing the sexual health field, while providing an avenue that prioritizes healthier conversations for people's wellbeing. Cindy seen in Cosmopolitan, Pop Sugar, and Well and Good as a trusted resource in all things gender, pleasure and wellness.

[00:01:21] Cindy, welcome to the podcast. 

[00:01:23] Cindy: Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here and to speak with you. 

[00:01:28] Josie: Awesome. Will you share with us your pronouns and where and the world you're joining us today?

[00:01:35] Cindy: My pronouns are she/ they, and right now I am in Long Beach, California. 

[00:01:40] Josie: Nice, cool. So I would love to know more about your story of what led you to become a sexual health expert, and specifically what drew you to specializing in gender pleasure and wellness. 

[00:01:56] Cindy: Yeah, so I guess the moment that changed everything was back in 2015 when I was diagnosed with a grapefruit sized ovarian cyst. That was after I had been on birth control for six years, and I just had no connection with that part of my body. 

[00:02:20] I just remember being taught that, you know, don't get pregnant because my parents had me as a teenager, so that like, they were afraid that I was, that their kids were gonna repeat the same thing and they wanted other things for us in life.

[00:02:36] So I got diagnosed and I had to have that ovary removed, and then I started looking into other alternatives, not hormonal birth control options. And I came across the fertility awareness method, or in layman's terms, it's just tracking your cycle every day. And checking your biomarkers like cervical mucus, basal, body temperature.

[00:03:07] And I just started reading up on that and learning more. Understanding signs that our bodies go through that indicate fertility and not fertile. So that just blew my mind and I realized like, wow, I didn't get any of this education. And then I started sharing that with my husband and he's like, Well, are you sure?

[00:03:30] This kind of sounds like the rhythm method or what our grandparents used to say it was. And then, you know, things have, I was like, No, no, no. Like I've, I've read the science. So, you know, I pretty much taught him too. And that helped me get control of like, having better communication like, Hey, I'm ovulating right now., we should use a barrier or something, 

[00:03:59] It really opens up that conversation and so that moment really made me reflect on just how I was brought up around religion and cultural things as Latina, Central American, Salvadorian, Guatemalan specifically. And I mentioned that because those countries are very, very still conservative in a lot of these topics. So we inherit those things. We have ideas about gender and pleasure and wellness, and this is why I talk about those things. Because it's not, it's still such a behind the behind closed doors conversation.

[00:04:41] And I really wanna show people that we can move forward and we can have education on this. And it's not some like sexual deviance. Or it's not some sinful thing to have these conversations. It actually benefits your health and the health of your relationships and accessing reproductive healthcare and preventing things like, you know, I don't want people to have to go through what I went through to finally wake up and be like, Oh shoot, I should probably learn about this part of my health.

[00:05:16] Which is so essential to anything. If that's affected, it affects your mental health. It affects how you show up in relationships, it affects how you communicate. So that was really like the big catalyst in my career journey and it, and I decided like, Let me go, Let me go deep. Let me become this, you know? 

[00:05:38] Josie: Yeah, totally. Oh, I love that. Yeah, I can relate to that so much. I have really clear memories of reading Taking Charge of Your Fertility for the first time. That book by Toni Weschler. And I was just like, Why wasn't this taught in schools? Why isn't this common knowledge? This is, it was just like, I was so angry. 

[00:05:58] Cindy: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. 

[00:06:00] Josie: Yeah, totally. And I think too, for folks who, you know, queer folks who are with a non sperm producing partner don't have to necessarily worry or track their cycle or know about their cervical mucus or anything like that. And then when they start trying to conceive, they're like, Oh, wait a minute, Like, what is all this? 

[00:06:22] Cindy: Yeah, definitely. And, that's part of what I noticed, and this is why I talk about gender. And I, you know, I'm a queer woman as well. I'm bisexual, and I recently finally came to accepting that about myself because of, like I mentioned earlier, the religious stuff.

[00:06:40] I'm not out to every single person in my family. But I feel more comfortable in spaces like this to say like, Hey, I'm showing up as myself and I'm somebody who is educating the public. And I wanna make it normal. You know, we're just, we exist too. Like we're here.

[00:06:58] We educate too. We're professionals. We're not confused. We're not troubled. Like we can do these things too. So that what I saw in the fertility awareness space is like, it's still very cisgendered. I am in a cis perceived relationship. So that's what I saw in the fertility awareness space is that it was always from a very cisgendered lens.

[00:07:21] And I would always think like, well, if a queer couple wants to conceive, This could be useful for them too. 

[00:07:29] Josie: Right, exactly. Yeah, I love that. So cool. Well, thank you for showing up here as your whole self. I love that. 

[00:07:39] Cindy: Thanks. 

[00:07:40] Josie: So I'm wondering, I would love to chat with you about just the collective stress and grief that we've all been experiencing for the past couple years. I know that I've seen just such a spike in anxiety and depression and grief and loss and stress in my private practice when I'm working with patients and over the last couple years. And I'm wondering from your point of view, how has the last couple years of that collective stress and grief, impacted our sexual health and our fertility?

[00:08:14] Cindy: Yeah, that's such a really good question and a such a layered question too. There's no one answer to that. I think it just shows up differently and on an individual level and even within our communities. 

[00:08:26] I think when it comes to stress and grief. Grief can add more to stress, right? And you can be stressed out because you're grieving. With a lot of loss that's been going on and stuff like that, I think what is common for people is to say, I don't have time to date, or be in a relationship, or even like worry about my pleasure, like that just kind of seems to be like the first thing to go. 

[00:08:51] And so they just think like, Well, I'm just like trying to get through this. Why would I need to make time or schedule, time to masturbate or wanna be intimate with a partner. So I think those things are just very common and that's how that can affect our sexual health.

[00:09:07] Or just thinking like, just not taking the taking time to have the conversations. Let's say you are trying to be with a new partner and then maybe somebody is like, they might forget to take a barrier method, or to take their birth control. All these things can really, really impact. And I'm not saying it's for everybody, but I think those are the really small things that can show up and we don't even notice it because we're stressed and we're grieving. 

[00:09:36] Josie: Right, right. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, and I think too that stress just has such a negative impact on being fertile.

[00:09:47] Cindy: Yeah, totally. Yeah, it does. And it's, and I hate to say this, but it's because it's such a, like, it comes down to such a biological thing. That your body is like, this is not the safest environment right now to conceive, so we're just gonna shut it down.

[00:10:06] And your cycle, your hormonal cycle, you know ovulation, all that is so connected to your endocrine system. And if we know anything about that, it's the most sensitive system in your body. Like any type of stress will throw it off. That's why you have delayed ovulation.

[00:10:24] That's why you have, my period showed up late or showed up early, or I'm bleeding for an extended period of time that wasn't like that before. Or I skipped a period. All of that, it's so tied to stress and how that's affected. 

[00:10:38] Josie: What would be your advice to folks to support themselves and to get themselves back on track fertility wise, especially as queer folks on a fertility journey, while dealing with this collective stress and grief, what's your advice for folks?

[00:10:53] Cindy: Yeah, I think seeking some professional qualified support. That doesn't necessarily have to be a mental health therapist but it could be, who knows? I'm thinking like culturally, right? Maybe it's somebody who does limpias for you. Maybe it's somebody does a spiritual counsel for you.

[00:11:13] Just having somebody to speak these things out and help walk you through your feelings, I think is important. We tend to, at least for myself, I've learned that holding in emotions isn't always the healthiest thing. So those avenues can definitely be a source to release a lot of that stuff, and help get clearer on what your next steps are going to be. 

[00:11:41] And I think just having people who are around you to help support you. It could also be like somebody who knows fertility really well and that can support you like somebody like yourself, right? Or just seeking out an educator, taking a class. You know, just things like that that may not necessarily be in the norm for you. Or, you know, let's say you're just somebody who's like, I just need to take a pause altogether. Right. And that's, that's okay too. 

[00:12:04] Josie: Yeah. I agree. Sometimes that is a good thing to do is to just like regroup. Pause on everything. Yeah. And what do you think pleasure's role is in all that? 

[00:12:17] Cindy: I'm thinking again, right? Cuz the movies again, like they're always from a very cisgendered perspective, but like, you see the couples, I'm thinking of a movie, like probably some movie that like JLo came out in or something. Well, like What Not to Expect or something like that. Where it's like, they're trying to conceive and it's so hard and this and that and it's like planned and they're like, Let's go now.

[00:12:39] I only have like 24 hours. This egg is good. You know, all that stuff, very like robotic and stuff, you know? But I think what pleasure means isn't necessarily like having intercourse or like, genitals activity. It could be just simply like getting a massage from your partner or, going out and having a picnic with somebody.

[00:13:03] You know, it's just things that make you feel good. To help reconnect with that intimate part of yourself and explore. Like, Okay, I want to cuddle, but I don't necessarily wanna get like sexual. 

[00:13:16] Josie: Right. Yeah, totally. Yeah, and I think kind of flooding your system with all of those love hormones can really open up those fertility pathways. 

[00:13:28] Cindy: I also think like other avenues, like maybe you wanna listen to some audio, or maybe you wanna read like an erotica book or something like that. Like just thinking outside the box of activating your senses and being like, Okay, this does make me feel good, or this does turn me on, you know?

[00:13:44] And knowing that you're allowed to feel that along with the grief. It's not just like, I can only feel grief now, and I can only feel pleasure now. We're still layered and we're still multidimensional and feelings like there can be more than one at the same time, and so I think it's okay to allow that to be simultaneous. 

[00:14:03] Josie: Yeah. Oh, thanks for saying that. Yeah. I would love to kind of dive into that a little bit deeper. Like how, how can folks do that? Like, feel both at once? 

[00:14:14] Cindy: Yeah, well, I think it comes down to communication, just naming your feelings. What I think. Again, has been so portrayed in the media. Is when we talk about like SA, Right. And survivors of SA. And it's like this really, really traumatizing thing. And then there, it becomes this pathologized experience where it's like, Oh, well you're troubled now, you're traumatized. And this is why you have this like, kink or this, you know, tied to like pleasure, right?

[00:14:49] Josie: Right. And by SA you mean sexual assault? Is that right?

[00:14:51] Cindy: Yeah. 

[00:14:51] Josie: Okay, just yeah, clarifying. 

[00:14:53] Cindy: And so it becomes this like every sexual experience is like really traumatizing. And I'm not saying that it can't be, it could be totally. But I think that also, having a conversation with somebody who feels safe. And saying like, Hey, like I might get triggered by this.

[00:15:12] I prefer if you. Only explored this part of my body, or I have preferred if you only use these kinds of words, you know? Are you, do you have the capacity to help me on this healing journey because I have experienced this. Like, just saying it like straight out, you know, just naming the thing, which I know is like really, really hard. Especially in dating now and online dating and stuff like that.

[00:15:37] But what I love about the generations now is and I was speaking about like Gen Z and younger, is that they want to do that. They wanna be different and so I encourage that totally because I think there's so many things that generations before us didn't do. They didn't have those conversations. When were they ever going to have that type of conversation.

[00:16:03] Totally. And I think just naming it and just being vulnerable and just being honest. And understanding like that doesn't, that vulnerability, I always tell people that vulnerability doesn't necessarily need to lead to a long term romantic relationship. 

[00:16:21] Josie: Mm, good point. 

[00:16:22] Cindy: Yeah. Which I think is what tends to be the narrative, especially if you come from a religious background. And, and it doesn't have to be like that.

[00:16:33] Josie: Oh my gosh, that's such a good point. Cuz I automatically think, I didn't even realize I make, I make that connection in my mind, but I absolutely do . 

[00:16:42] Cindy: Yeah, it's so, it's so ingrained in us from like early on and I think it doesn't have to be that way. If you don't want, if you don't want it to be that way, it doesn't have to be that way.

[00:16:52] Josie: And I love what you said about, just flat out asking, do you have the capacity to support me? Through this trigger or this trauma. 

[00:17:01] Cindy: Yeah. And having a trigger plan, you know? Like, Okay, if this comes up, I'm gonna take a pause, or I'm gonna need five minutes to regroup. Or I'm gonna need to talk about it, or whatever that looks like. I think you're, you're so allowed to do that for yourself. Give yourself permission to do that. 

[00:17:21] Josie: Yes, I love that. I love that. Yeah. And do you work with a lot of Gen Zers? 

[00:17:26] Cindy: I have been lately. Yeah. I have been for sure. I have been a lot lately. It's, it's interesting. And I do have a younger sibling who's Gen Z also. I'm like a, I guess I would be called a Xen, like a ex Xen. And then we have a Millennial sibling, and then we have a Gen Z sibling. My parents really like spread us apart. So like now, me being in this profession, I get to teach some of these things to my younger sibling, which is really interesting. You know, and her friends too.

[00:17:58] Josie: So how is that different working with Gen Zers? I'm so curious. 

[00:18:03] Cindy: They're much more open and less reserved about the questions and the curiosities that they have. They're just like, I want to. But I will say this, that I think a lot of times, Some people tend to overanalyze and wanna be so like, perfect right? About, about these experiences. 

[00:18:22] And I remind them like, look, sometimes it's gonna be go with the flow. Just make sure that you're still inquisitive and curious. Know when you have your boundaries, and you're allowed to express those things. 

[00:18:33] So as long as you, I try to, at least. That's my teaching approach. To share with them because I think it becomes when you overthink and you overanalyze it, it kind of takes away from the experience of like, You're in the moment and you're trying to receive and give pleasure at the same time. 

[00:18:50] Josie: Right. I can see how that would be tricky to sort of walk that line between getting consent and you know, constantly and then also like being in the moment and being open to spontaneity. 

[00:19:03] Cindy: Yeah, totally. There's this whole thing about, at least from my generation, there was this, and before there was this whole idea that like, oh, well, consent, kind of like, kills the mood. No it doesn't. That's BS. It doesn't kill the mood. If anything.

[00:19:19] I think talking about it could be a turn on already. Cause you're like excited. You're getting anticipated of like, Oh, okay, what can we do? Is this gonna happen? You know? 

[00:19:26] Josie: Yeah, totally. I agree. It can make it hotter. I love that. Well, I would love to switch gears and talk about womb work as shadow work. This is something I've seen you talk about on your Instagram, and I am fascinated by this topic because I feel like we hold so much in our womb and not only like, personal trauma, but also ancestral trauma. 

[00:19:50] And myself, as someone that I dealt with years and years of really severe endometriosis and I had lots of fertility struggles because of that. To me that really rings true. Just that concept of dealing with my endometriosis did feel like shadow work to me. So I would love you to speak about what that is to you, like womb work as shadow work. And then we'll kind of dive into that. 

[00:20:14] Cindy: Yeah. Well, you know, I'll speak from my personal experience. Like I mentioned, I had the cysts, and then I had to really dive deep like. Yeah, I don't know anything about this part of my body. Like I've been so disconnected because of the stories that I was told in the past, and like, what value lies in that part of my body? How I'll be perceived if I just like go and have sex with people before marriage and all of that stuff.

[00:20:41] And so that part of our body, I wanna say our pelvic region, our reproductive region, right? It's the seed of your emotions. So when we're speaking more in terms of like spiritual, you know, philosophies and ideologies, right? 

[00:20:58] If you work with the chakra system, if you thinking about the chakra system, right, with reiki and, and Japanese like healing modalities, that region is your sacral chakra and that's where a lot of emotions are stored. That's where you can hold onto a lot of, like you mentioned, ancestral historical narratives, history and stuff like that. And so if you think about it, if you go back far enough, you think about colonization, right?

[00:21:26] It ranged from, you know, rape and coercion to, some people maybe did fall in love, right? But you know, all of that has trauma and history in itself. And so we carry that. If we don't talk about those things, as understanding like we are a part of that history. Me being central American Latina, I have colonizer ancestry, and I have indigenous ancestry, and so I have to know that when I show up in different spaces. 

[00:21:55] And part of that work is for me teaching what I teach. And bringing up those conversations and saying, We're gonna talk about the taboo things because it's for your health. It's actually going to help break these generational cycles.

[00:22:10] There's just so much, and to be really, really transparent with your listeners and with you. I grew up in a domestic violence household. Violence was just a part of my growing up, so I had to learn a lot. I've done a lot of therapy, I've done a lot of spiritual work and things like that and dove into my history and just seeing the patterns and you know, just the patterns of unhealthy love and wounded love.

[00:22:37] Unhealthy, toxic relationships that were just so normal in my family tree. And I'm like, damn, this is where all this come from. So that's part of womb work, just looking at that and it's not easy. It's heavy, it's dark.

[00:22:53] It can definitely get you in a place of depression. But learning all of that has really helped. Now say, Okay, well I know all of this. I can either repeat these things or I can decide that I want to live my life different and start like breaking cycles. Against all of that stuff. And trust me, like sometimes I'm still like, I can't tell grandma certain things cause I don't wanna, you know? Cause I don't wanna like get into this conversation with her, but like, I have empathy for like why they can't.

[00:23:24] Josie: Ooh, yeah. I can totally relate to that. And also I can relate to, and I think a lot of folks in my audience too have colonizer and colonized ancestry within them. And I feel like that's really dark work. Cause it's like that violence, that interaction with the resulted violence is like in our blood, in our cells. 

[00:23:47] Cindy: Yeah, it totally is. And you know, it's not easy. It's hard to face that fact and that reality. But I hope through this work that people can understand what role they have now and how they can really with one change, break that cycle even within their own families.

[00:24:08] Josie: Yeah, I agree. It feels like just like shining a light on what's happened because that's, I feel like that's, most of it is just like this happened. And just seeing it, naming it. And just like, yeah, bringing it out into the light. Cuz in the past I feel like, especially within our families, like things are just so taboo. It's like, ugh, don't mention that. Or don't say that. 

[00:24:32] Cindy: Yeah. And, for us it's, you know, if anybody speaks Spanish, it's that saying "el que diran" like, what will they say? What will the people say? It's like what people? What are you so worried about? Why are you so worried? But I think that that comes from like a concept of we were from very communal. Countries and it was like, the people are gonna know it's cuz you knew everybody in your freaking Colonial or Pueblo or wherever. 

[00:24:53] Josie: Totally. Yeah. And how do you think that doing shadow work connects with fertility? Do you think that, that Yeah. What's the connection there? 

[00:25:03] Cindy: Yeah. You know, I tend to do shadow work through writing. I started writing really, really young, and I think it came from, No, I know. It was my mom, she really tried her best to give us the tools to help us work through our emotions, knowing that she was in a really unhealthy and toxic marriage with my dad. 

[00:25:27] So we, at least for me, I was the, the first one, we didn't have the resources to go and get therapy or counseling at school, So I remember early on she got me a journal, and a diary. I think it was like a little Lion King one. I remember it. It had like a little lock and everything. I was all excited. But you know, I learned, I remember her telling me like, when you start feeling certain things, write your feelings down, okay. And I was like, Okay. 

[00:25:51] And I didn't realize for the longest time, like I've just been, everybody talks now about journaling, but like, I've been since I can remember. I was like, Okay, I really, I really am a writer. I haven't like published a book, but I write like daily. And that just, I always thank my mom for that. Our parents, they go through a lot and our grandparents go through a lot and they do the best they can with the tools they have.

[00:26:13] And I'm thankful for the small tools that I was given. And I have a little bit more now in my toolkit and can teach other people. So that's part of my shadow work is writing. And that can be for other people as well. Just write what comes up. For some people it might be, I think it's a lot of the narratives you have to really excavate and think like, is this mine or am I carrying somebody else's trauma or anxiety and stuff like that. And I realized a lot. The things I was carrying were not my own. 

[00:26:48] Josie: Yeah, totally. Yeah. Oh, writing is such good medicine. I'd say that's my primary tool as well. And I'm also a writer and that's how I've gotten through all of my everything is by writing. Yeah. Yeah. Props to your mom. That's awesome.

[00:27:05] Cindy: I know. Shout out mom.

[00:27:07] Josie: Yeah, I love that. Well, something I talk about a lot is in Chinese medicine, our fertility is referred to as our essence. So the more we're able to get in touch with who we are, or our essence, the more access we have to our fertile potential or our creative power. So that's what I teach in my whole self fertility method. And so I like to ask all my guests, do you have any practices or rituals in place that allow you to connect with that essence of who you are?

[00:27:34] Cindy: So I'm a big, I come from a family that's like super musically inclined. So music is like super healing for me. Any type of music really. I play an instrument myself. It's something that I've been trying to get back into. I play the alto sax. So that's really like getting back into that, just sitting and, and learning again and allowing myself to not be perfect about that. Cuz I still struggle with perfectionist stuff. I think like we all do.

[00:28:03] And, and that's been really like, helps me like, wait. My younger self really loves this and I'm gonna, take time to do it. And I think just tapping into and being curious and exploring, I also, now that I'm out here with family, right now, I get to see my nieces. And I get to play with them.

[00:28:23] And I realize like, oh, you know, we can just like play. And the childhood, your child self forgets that sometimes you can just play and imagine and pretend, and I love that. I love that I get to be that tia and just have fun with them and play. 

[00:28:39] Josie: Yes. Ugh. Yeah. I've been thinking about that concept a lot lately, that our essence really has a lot to do with who we were as a kid. 

[00:28:49] Cindy: Yeah. I loved playing sports. I was also a kid that really, really loved being in nature, like I was just, Like always looking up at the sky. I think I had like, really, My mom says, like, I had some really like deep philosophical questions when I was a kid. She'd be like, Mom, how are we?

[00:29:07] I'd be like, Mom, how are we alive right now? She'd be like, What do you mean? She'd be like, Like, Am I alive? So she'll bring it up like every once in a while. Like, remember when you asked if we were alive? I was like, what I meant to say. How are we here right now? But you know, like just that curiosity, you know?

[00:29:25] Josie: Yes, ugh. I love that. And it's such a different energy, I think, to be a tia than the parent. You can really just, you're not in that like responsible mode. You can really just kind of let loose and get down on the ground with them. 

[00:29:40] Cindy: Yeah, and it's funny to see the differences and they see me like if I put on makeup and they're like, can you put makeup? And I'm like, Okay, let me ask your mom if it's okay first. And that stuff, like, I did that as a kid too. I remember like my tias and my mom, they always had their makeup bag and I was always super curious and I'd be like, Ooh, like, what do they have? And I'd play around with that too.

[00:30:01] So, yeah, that's what helps me tap into my essence too, is like when I play with makeup or like I fix myself or like, it get really fun with like a cool, like fun graphic liner. Like I just love it's part of like my artistic expression. I think, just wearing makeup too. 

[00:30:17] Josie: Yeah. Oh, I love that. Yeah, totally. I used to be really into makeup and I loved that also it felt like painting. Yeah. So cool. Thank you for sharing those practices with us. I love hearing, like everyone has such a different answer to that question. 

[00:30:31] Cindy: Mm-hmm. , That's a really good question. 

[00:30:33] Josie: Yeah. Oh, good. So Cindy, how can folks find you online and support you and sign up for all your things?

[00:30:43] Cindy: You can find me on Instagram mostly. I mean, I'm on all the platforms now. Like I'm on Twitter, I'm on TikTok slowly trying build my TikTok. So please, guys, come follow me. Come watch my videos, gimme some love. Tiktok's really fun actually. I've grown to like it now.

[00:31:00] Instagram, I'm on Pinterest, you know. Oh yeah. I'm, I'm one of the OGs of Pinterest, I knew it before people were like, What's that? I'm like, It's like online scrapbooking, like you should look at it, and now it's like super popular. And then my website howlatthewomb.com, that's with two T's.

[00:31:17] So I have my services that are available. I do workshops, I do professional trainings, which is something that I've been shifting toward now, like I've been doing this work for seven years and I get a lot of questions of like, do you provide mentorship? Do you provide training? So I'm building that out right now.

[00:31:37] That'll be coming out soon. For people who are just interested, like people who are healers, people who maybe educators or professionals in a different space. Coaches that I can teach them the concepts. Just consent and showing up for their clients fully. And also being responsible enough in the field to say, This is out of my scope but I have somewhere I can reference you to cuz I think that's super important.

[00:32:05] I think as healers or people who wanna help other people, you're like, end up taking on more than, than you can handle, but it's okay to be like, this is actually out of my scope, but I know somebody who can help you. And so I really wanna provide that training as well for people to just show up fully in their practice and help the people that they're there to serve.

[00:32:25] Josie: Nice, I love that. And I love that you serve such a broad umbrella of folks. Like it's not just people who are trying to start a family or not trying to start a family. It's like, everybody. 

[00:32:38] Cindy: Yeah. It's so needed. It's necessary, you know? It's important that we all get educated on, on these things because it just helps us understand everybody's humanity, which is really what we all want, and why we're fighting so hard for justice and racial justice. Just basic humanity, you know? Let me live. 

[00:32:56] Josie: Yeah, totally. Yeah, I agree. Can I also just say that I love the name of your business immensely. 

[00:33:03] Cindy: Thanks, . Thank you.

[00:33:05] Josie: How did you come up with that name? 

[00:33:07] Cindy: That was kind of like a, again, like a spiritual messaging, ancestral message. Dream type of thing. And I was like, Huh? Howl at the Womb, Ooh, this is interesting. And I was like, Okay, let me go with it. And it kind of stuck. So I'm glad it's well received.

[00:33:25] Josie: Yes. Oh, well, Cindy, thank you so, so much for the incredible work that you do and for being here with us today and sharing your wisdom, so wonderful. 

[00:33:36] Cindy: Thank you. Thank you for inviting me, Josie. This is a lot of fun.

[00:33:45] Josie: Thanks for listening to the Intersectional Fertility Podcast. To get customized fertility recommendations based on your Whole Self Fertility Method element, join my mailing list at intersectionalfertility.com and get immediate access to my two minute quiz. 

[00:34:02] If you like the show and wanna hear more, tap subscribe on your favorite podcast platform and please leave us a review. It really truly helps. The Intersectional Fertility podcast is hosted by me, Josie Rodriguez-Bouchier, and produced by For the Love Media. With original music by Jen Korte.

All content offered through The Intersectional Fertility Podcast is created for informational purposes only, it is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition.